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Large coleman under 74 Ford

Posted By RileyF100 6 Years Ago
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RileyF100
Posted 6 Years Ago
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From what I have gathered from google, 266700C1 and 266701C1 are 6 bolt axles when I need 8 bolts. I couldn't find any sizing information on the other 2 pairs though. I will try to get a good measurement this weekend, but a very rough estimate would be ~43" Long and ~38" short with a 8x6.25 bolt pattern.
266700C1
266700C1 Long            53.000 INCHES NOMINAL I think
266701C1 Short - See more at: http://forums.justoldtrucks.com/Post.aspx?TopicID=60387&PageIndex=1&Task=PostTopicReply&ParentID=60387#sthash.22r1fIMn.dpuf
266700C1 Long            53.000 INCHES NOMINAL I think
266701C1 Short - See more at: http://forums.justoldtrucks.com/Post.aspx?TopicID=60387&PageIndex=1&Task=PostTopicReply&ParentID=60387#sthash.22r1fIMn.dpuf
266700C1 Long            53.000 INCHES NOMINAL I think
266701C1 Short - See more at: http://forums.justoldtrucks.com/Post.aspx?TopicID=60387&PageIndex=1&Task=PostTopicReply&ParentID=60387#sthash.22r1fIMn.dpuf
266700C1 Long            53.000 INCHES NOMINAL I think
266701C1 Short - See more at: http://forums.justoldtrucks.com/Post.aspx?TopicID=60387&PageIndex=1&Task=PostTopicReply&ParentID=60387#sthash.22r1fIMn.dpuf
266700C1 Long            53.000 INCHES NOMINAL I think
266701C1 Short - See more at: http://forums.justoldtrucks.com/Post.aspx?TopicID=60387&PageIndex=1&Task=PostTopicReply&ParentID=60387#sthash.22r1fIMn.dpuf
266700C1 Long            53.000 INCHES NOMINAL I think
266701C1 Short  - See more at: http://forums.justoldtrucks.com/Post.aspx?TopicID=60387&PageIndex=1&Task=PostTopicReply&ParentID=60387#sthash.22r1fIMn.dpuf
266700C1 Long            53.000 INCHES NOMINAL I think
266701C1 Short  - See more at: http://forums.justoldtrucks.com/Post.aspx?TopicID=60387&PageIndex=1&Task=PostTopicReply&ParentID=60387#sthash.22r1fIMn.dpuf
Tony Bullard
Posted 6 Years Ago
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I would first see if these IH part number axles will fit. They are from a Coleman model 9, 9000# axle.

266700C1 Long            53.000 INCHES NOMINAL I think
266701C1 Short            34.000 INCHES NOMINAL I think

296776C1 Long           
296777C1 Short

From a heavier axle
196694R1
196695R1



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RileyF100
Posted 6 Years Ago
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If I cannot source a pair of axle shafts, is there an economic way to get a pair made/modified to fit?
ppsyclone
Posted 6 Years Ago
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Some Coleman axles were supplied by the manufacturer and Coleman converted them from a rear axle to a steerable front axle by altering ther xale and mounting their hub asseblies. I have seen K/KB IHs converted to 4wd by Coleman. The differential clearly has the 3 diamond I H logo. There were a few WC Whites, probably late 40's/early 50s with a Coleman converted White axle. They had domed Coleman hubs with the White script. There was also the B426 Mack usung a Coleman converted Mack axle.
Tony Bullard
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IH used Coleman front axles on some of there bigger trucks. Irishmike has the parts books with IH part numbers Here . TM 119, 127 and TM 132 have them. Expand them and select the the G02.Front Axle.PDF


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chtrout
Posted 6 Years Ago
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Jeff,

Thanks for the heads-up on the Herrington photo on pg. 253 in Fred Crismon's "U.S. Military Wheeled Vehicles." I had not noticed it before. (I tend to be rather Coleman-centric in my reading... Ha!)

Crismon is usually highly accurate in his data and specs, but I have found that he is sometimes a bit "soft" on his dates, at least on his Coleman images. The first question that jumps to mind is did he just assume Art Herrington remained with QMC after 1925 or so until joining MH in 1931, and was just guessing to fill in the gap, or did he actually find documentation that Art actually remained on Camp Holabird staff the entire time?

We can’t get away from the full documentation that Art Herrington was the General Manager of the Coleman Motors Corporation "Eastern Branch" from at least 1928 until about 1930, and perhaps even a year or two earlier. Perhaps he was holding down both jobs (QMC and Coleman) at once, but the QMC position from 1928 to about 1930 seems to be a bit lacking in actual documentation (unless you find an original source that is compelling).

I did notice that in Marc K. Blackburn’s touchstone work on "The United States Army and the Motor Truck – A Case Study in Standardization" (1996), Marc attributes the standardization push in 1928-1933 to John L. DeWitt, Col. Edgar Stayer, and Lt. Col. Brainerd Taylor, all on Camp Holabird staff, and interestingly, Art Herrington is not mentioned as still being present or playing any role at all. This is a very scholarly, well-researched study and appears to be very thorough in most regards. Art was such a "huge presence" at the time, I would think he would be mentioned if present.

Don’t know, just interesting stuff to ponder...  Regardless, Art Herrington was certainly an interesting guy. 

It's funny how many things were interrelated at various times. Peter De Paolo had also been Harleigh Holmes’ initial pick to drive a Coleman racer in the 1930 Indy-500, but events finally prevented this from happening.

On a side note, I was very saddened to hear of Fred Crismon's recent passing, he was a huge resource for anyone interested in military vehicles. 

Craig H. Trout
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Researching Holmes / Plains / Coleman / American Coleman Trucks
and selected production partners, such as Columbian Steel Tank, Quick Way Truck Shovel, Howe-Coleman, International Harvester, Marmon-Herrington, and SnowBlast

chtrout
Posted 6 Years Ago
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Hey RileyF100,

Sorry that Jeff and I wandered off on an Art Herrington "visit"...

I just posted a whole series of Colman 4x4 axle diagrams and images over on the Coleman thread. You might want to take a look, they may be very helpful for you. I posted them over there since they will be more likely to be seen by other Coleman buffs that may have questions in the future.

Craig H. Trout
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Researching Holmes / Plains / Coleman / American Coleman Trucks
and selected production partners, such as Columbian Steel Tank, Quick Way Truck Shovel, Howe-Coleman, International Harvester, Marmon-Herrington, and SnowBlast

RileyF100
Posted 6 Years Ago
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Thank you Jeff and Craig, now I can give the companies I am emailing a little more info and I might actually be able to determine what parts I am missing. As long as there are no bearings/retainers missing from where the axle shaft goes into the tube I may be in luck as the previous owner might still have the axle shafts and then I don't see anything else missing.
Jeff Lakaszcyck
Posted 6 Years Ago
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Well, I guess we have officially hijacked this thread !
Craig, you have certainly done your research, and Art Herrington's connection to Coleman is fascinating. It turns out I am a little off on my dates of Herrington's service to the Quartermaster Corps, but I was pretty close. I think that Fred Crismon's "U.S. Military Wheeled Vehicles" gives the best explanation of Herrington's dates of service to the QMC on page 253. The Ft. Holabird assembled TTL model 1923 1-1/2 ton 4x4 truck was built in 1922-23, and the photo shows a young Herrington driving a very new appearing truck. The text states that Herrington had a major part in the engineering of the TTL, and goes on to say he "served with the Quartermaster Corps at Ft. Holabird until around 1930", when he left to build his own trucks. So it would appear that Herrington started with the QMC around 1922 and was with them 8 years or so. He was certainly a busy guy, as he also served as "pit manager" for the 1922 Indianapolis 500 winner Jimmy Murphey, and again for 1925 winner Pete DePaulo. The second night after his wedding in 1926, Herrington entertained his new bride at the Duesenburg factory, helping Fred Duesenburg assemble his new racer, which was driven by Pete DePaulo to fifth place. This info is from "The Marmon Heritage".
 .

Jeff
ppsyclone
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I am not sure when the Coleman factory in Littleton stopped doing conversions there. However Howe Brothers contiued to do them on all kinds of trucks. Louisville Fords were common conversions. The easiest way to tell a howe conversion is the the way the fill in the fender gap over the front wheels to compensate for the increased height of the coversion. Howe would convert anything. I have seen A and B Macks, White 3000s and others. MH had a picture of a Diamnond Reo conversion with a Coleman axle on their website a few years ago. 


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